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nate
02-09-2009, 09:05 AM
For the past few days, Ihave been emailing back and forth with Carla Everett. She works for tach but Idon't know what she really does or what her position is. Ido know that she contacted me 1st when the new regs went into effect.





Anyway, We have been emailing back and forth arguing over the effectiveness of the regs. Today, she wrote that if Ihad a better idea, to send it in and get a petition started.





Basically, Itold her my idea was for the cuffs to be taken off of game ranches so that they could buy all hogs. Iwent on to say that Ihad no faith in our govt. so Idon't know that a petition would do any good. Imean, they made their minds up long ago.





What Itold Carla, was that with buying stations shutting down, the plan to put a dent in the hog population is failing.





What are y'alls thoughts on the idea of letting ranches buy all the hogs they can?

CODY
02-09-2009, 09:14 AM
I think that ranches should be able to buy all the hogs they want.http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/thumleft.gif

nate
02-09-2009, 09:20 AM
CODY (http://www.texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=CODY) wrote...


I think that ranches should be able to buy all the hogs they want.http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/thumleft.gif








Ihope that everyone thinks like that. Maybe we could get tach to loosen up an the regs. Carla and Ihave become quite the pen pals but Isee she is 100% govt.





Maybe we could start a petition and send it her way.

bryon
02-09-2009, 09:24 AM
I think the same as ya;ll the buying of hogs is the only way some of Us can hunting to pay for fuel feed and the time you go and come home emty handed what we do for fun at some point cost us alot for them who do it alot and is away to curb the number of hogs in areas that they dont wont them. you dont see the Parks takeing all the wild game and giveing the health checks but yet they also let hunter;s in the trim the herds so i say if they do this then they be willing to do the same ,or just leave things alone. this pic;s for James

herefishy
02-09-2009, 09:46 AM
I wasn't aware of any regultion relating to the limit on the number of swine that could be purchased (during any time period?).





I thought that the issue was the cost of the testing for relocation of boars, which resulted in lower demand and as such the lower price at the quarantine location.





Relating back to another thread (that everyone hates me for), the advice that I offered to the game ranch operator, was to raise pricing accordingly in order to cover the tangible 20% increase in the cost of the prize boar. As such, perhaps the quarantine operator should do so accordingly. Eventually, there will be only (a minimal) number ofcertified wild swine quarantine faciltiy that will take it out of the arse of the game ranch operator, anyway - not to mention the cost of transportation to and from limited facilities.





The costs of the quarantine operator has increased with record-keeping, his sales price should follow accordingly. If there is lower demand because of the increased price, the logical business decision would be to decrease inventory. I think that if the industry held it's ground.... trapper... quarantine operator.... game ranch operator, the consumer demand for the product (Texas Hog Huntin') will satisfy the costs and expenditures of the industry and realize a nice profit. I don't think that the out-of-state business would decrease - there's too much of a reputation.





The increase in the cost of managing the wild feral swine herd will only result in a sustained and healthy feral herd, without the threat of damaging the commercial livestock herds (and cooperation amongst the commercial and game operations will only serve to compliment each industry).





Mind you, that in a recent post I offered a link to an (scientific/objective) test/survey of disease in feral swine in several Texas Counties... Performed recently in year 2008...





http://www.aasv.org/shap/issues/v16n6/v16n6p312.htm





and if you really looked at it.. the map/graphic anyway.. Particularly the Results Chart..... you will see that several South Texas Counties resulted in 41% to 100% positive results for PRV (Psuedo-rabies Virus). I don't think that even any game ranch operator would be inclined to indescriminately import boars that will transmit PRV to the native feral swine in his area, within the considerations of the longevity of his business, as the PRV results in swine abortions/death of piglets. Thus diminishing the local herd and affectinga game operators operation.





But as I think about it... if an operator is purchasing relocated boars, he obviously cannot have a local feral herd (sounders) across his property... would that be correct? Are the relocated boars only the ones who test negative? yet are still subject to containmenton the property?














Peace, and Kind Regards,





Mark

CODY
02-09-2009, 09:50 AM
nate (http://texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=nate) wrote...

CODY (http://www.texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=CODY) wrote...


I think that ranches should be able to buy all the hogs they want.http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/thumleft.gif








Ihope that everyone thinks like that. Maybe we could get tach to loosen up an the regs. Carla and Ihave become quite the pen pals but Isee she is 100% govt.





Maybe we could start a petition and send it her way.








Nate,I'd sign thatpetition right on the topbro.http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/cool.gif

nate
02-09-2009, 10:05 AM
Mark you still don't get it and Idon't know how to explain it where you can. If you will read the regs, you will find out that ranches cannot purchase sows. This hurts everyone in one way or another.





Buying stations don't have to pay much for them so trappers open their gates. The population is therefore not thinned out so the breeding continues. At least, with the game ranches, a big enough supply could be maintained so that the price stays low enough to encourage more killing.





Idon't want to see a rancher have to raise his/her prices to keep the operation open. If that happens, the plan will again backfire and hunters won't be so apt to pay the high costs to hunt a hog.





What Isee from you is, you are a hater of a long list of things to include: the huge hog problem, game ranches, plans to get the population under control, and others who don't share your ideas. Are you a tach employee?








Also, you keep refering to relocated boars. Why would someone from south Texas need to buy a boar from east Texas when there are soo many boars localy?





Mark...you just don't make any since with your thinking. If local hogs are infected, and they stay on local ranches, where is the spread of disease?

herefishy
02-09-2009, 10:08 AM
I understand that the the regulations do not permit the relocation of sows and gilts.





What is the TAHC reasoning for that?











Mark

nate
02-09-2009, 10:11 AM
herefishy (http://www.texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=herefishy) wrote...


I understand that the the regulations do not permit the relocation of sows and gilts.





What is the TAHC reasoning for that?











Mark








Idon't know what the reasoning behind that is. Maybe tach is in bed with local buying stations. Idon't think it is helping the numbers anyway.

herefishy
02-09-2009, 10:16 AM
Well, it seems that the limitation on the "boar only" transportation thingy is the mis communication between us.





Perhaps if the discussion relating to the limitation of "boar only" could be addressed, I could more thoroughly understand the concern.





It is simple to understand that an (operator) would want an optimum number of swine to offer to a client. However, why is the relocation of swine limited to boars onlywho pass disease testing?





Inquiring minds want to know.








Peace,





Mark

catchrcall
02-09-2009, 11:36 AM
herefishy,


game ranch operators that specialize on hogs often also specialize in what I like to call working man's hunts. Hunts for a couple hundred a weekend let you leave with a couple decent eating sized hogs and a smile. The reason that these game ranches cannot simply suck up the extra cost of testing everyboar that comes through the gates and then then up their prices to cover it is thatif that happens the days of a weekend lease that a working man can afford are over. If the ranches loose those hunts, they go under, and another business bites the dust. I am shocked, absolutely shocked,that you cannot see that. Right now the buying stations have no competition, no reason to pay a decent pricefor feral hogs because they are the only ones buying hogs, and the only ones allowed to buy female hogs. If the game ranches were back to buying, prices would go up and folks would go back to trapping, or tying dog caught hogs instead of sticking them.

herefishy
02-09-2009, 01:01 PM
catchrcall (http://texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=catchrcall) wrote...


herefishy,


game ranch operators that specialize on hogs often also specialize in what I like to call working man's hunts. Hunts for a couple hundred a weekend let you leave with a couple decent eating sized hogs and a smile. The reason that these game ranches cannot simply suck up the extra cost of testing everyboar that comes through the gates and then then up their prices to cover it is thatif that happens the days of a weekend lease that a working man can afford are over. If the ranches loose those hunts, they go under, and another business bites the dust. I am shocked, absolutely shocked,that you cannot see that. Right now the buying stations have no competition, no reason to pay a decent pricefor feral hogs because they are the only ones buying hogs, and the only ones allowed to buy female hogs. If the game ranches were back to buying, prices would go up and folks would go back to trapping, or tying dog caught hogs instead of sticking them.



Yes Catch,







However it would seem that the operator that depends on the (native) population would most be inclined to engage in the "working man's hunt". The fellows paying $300.00 per boar are pursuing a different market - not bubba's weekend hog hunt for some pork chops.





The regualations that are being questioned are relating to importation of swine onto someone's property. Nate indicates that the limitation of only disease free boars to the exclusion of sows and gilts are affecting the (high-end) game ranch industry, and what I am trying to understand is what the reasoning is behing the limitations on the relocation of the sows and gilts (byt the TAHC under the direction of the USDA)... which (Nate) seems to be concerned about.'








????????????????





That's the information that I am looking for.... http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/wall.gif








Mark

catchrcall
02-09-2009, 02:23 PM
As I understand it the reason game ranches can't buy sows and gilts is because they are the "piglet factories". In a perfect TAHC double fenced , disease tested, and boar only world, a game ranch would not have a breeding population. No sows means no piglets and no piglets means no hogs later on to escape and add to the population. one sow could ruin that in a years time. I think the basic logic is that if the trapped sows are killed and only boars are sold to a game ranch, both will end up at a "terminal" destination, and the population will still decline. not sure if it's gonna work out that way, but who knows.

nate
02-11-2009, 01:56 AM
Let me try to express my concerns here so that everyone understands where Iam coming from. tach said ranches could no longer buy sows to "control the population"





As Catchrcall stated, now buying stations have no competition and don't pay squat so trappers are not trapping and sows are dropping litters everyday. If ranchers were allowed to buy sows, the would still be a decent effort in controlling the numbers were there is NO EFFORTNOW.





In short, tach's plan has backfired. Itried to target two different types of hunters.





1. The "working man" busting his butt to make ends meet but still wantinf an affordable hunt.





2. The "higher paid"(if you will) that did not consider money to be a factor.





With the tach regs, Icould not keep a fresh supply of targets so 50% of my client base disipates. What makes me mad Mark, is that you have the mindset that you don't care about small business owners trying to make a little extra cash. Your thoughts are "just raise the prices and roll with it" You don't understand or don't care that game ranches are trying to do their part in helping to control the hog numbers but now our hands are tied.





This is the problem Ihave with you and untill you start acting like a concerend hunter instead of a govt. official, I'm not gonna change my opinion. If it makes you mad, Idon't care. If I'm asked to leave here, so beit; but I am sick and tired of folks making game ranches to look like the bad guy.

herefishy
02-11-2009, 05:09 AM
I'm not mad. I seem however to be on the receiving end of some hostility regarding my posts in this subject matter... but that doesn't bother me... this is only the internet, and it is easy to to misinterpret or misrepresent the tone of what one is communicating in a medium such as this (bulletin board).





I'm not bothered.











Kind Regards,





Mark

squirt
02-11-2009, 02:19 PM
http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/wall.gifhttp://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/wall.gifhttp://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/wall.gifhttp://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/wall.gifFORGET THE GOVERNMENT. We should just hunt. I ain't a rancher, don't own land either. I ain't got the money to shop at cabela's (lie) IJUST WANT TO HOG HUNT WITH A FEW BROS FROM THE SITE. Can we just let the powers-that-be regulate, while we hunt????http://texashoghunter.com/images/images/forum/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

Jason
02-20-2009, 04:22 AM
I Agree with squirt 190% Cant we just all get along and hunt together. I for one dont care about the ranches or import export of hogs. I just want to put some food on the table and some meat in the freezer.

nate
02-24-2009, 02:19 AM
Jason (http://www.texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=Jason) wrote...


I Agree with squirt 190% Cant we just all get along and hunt together. I for one dont care about the ranches or import export of hogs. I just want to put some food on the table and some meat in the freezer.








With all do respect, 1st let me say thank you for serving our great country. Iunderstand your desire to hunt. I'm not sure Iunderstand your thoughts on game ranches. If it wasn't for game ranches, there would be thousands of folks who might not get the oppertunity to hunt.





Ihave spent 10's of thousands of dollars out of my own pocket pursuing my dream which was to have a place where a hard working individual could come and maybe bring their kid for a taste of excitment that can't be found just anywhere. These folks usually don't have time to run around public land in hopes of seeing a hog, but they could come to my place and be guarenteed a hog.





Game ranches are not for everyone, but to the ones who rely on them for a good time and a full cooler, they are dang near priceless.

catchrcall
02-26-2009, 05:58 AM
NO!!!!! We cannot just let the government regulate and go hunt. That's exactly what sportsman and gun owners in england and australia did and they wound up turning in their guns. That kind of attitude is exactly what will loose hunting and firearms ownership for law abiding citizens. As we speak, breed specific legislation and breeding legislation bills are moving through committees right here in texas. What does it matter? written into these bills are often hidden clauses such as a peace officer would not need a warrant to search the home and property of a liscenced kennel. That would effect a lot of sporting dog owners. Look at some of the states on the east coast, and of course california, and even colorado. First they outlaw something like trapping or bear baiting, and they chip away at our sport from their. They have even gotten some states to outlaw dove seasons. The only way we're gonna stop this garbage from happening is to get involved and help to stop it. Join sportsman's organizations, find out who your legislators are and contact them, and do what you can to keep our sports for our kids. Wake up folks, cause it's happening right now.

Jason
02-26-2009, 07:55 AM
Nate,


First off thanks for your support its really appreciated.





Ihave nothing against game ranches here trust me i would like to own one of my own one day. What i meant was if ranchers wanna breed hogs or import hogs or any wild game let them I for one just wanna be able to hunt wether it be on a ranch or in public land. and with the waythings are getting today with it being harder and harder to find public landI just think it should be up to the owners of the ranches and NOT UNCLESAM who decides were they get their game from and what type of game they want.





And also i was just trying to give humor with squirt about everyone arguingback and forth on a topic thats beyond our control as individuals, cause in actuality if we cant come together as one uncle sam aint going to care what we want.





thats why i sayLets stop arguing with each other and lets hunt.

nate
02-26-2009, 03:34 PM
Jason (http://texashoghunter.com/profile.php?user=Jason) wrote...


Nate,


First off thanks for your support its really appreciated.





Ihave nothing against game ranches here trust me i would like to own one of my own one day. What i meant was if ranchers wanna breed hogs or import hogs or any wild game let them I for one just wanna be able to hunt wether it be on a ranch or in public land. and with the waythings are getting today with it being harder and harder to find public landI just think it should be up to the owners of the ranches and NOT UNCLESAM who decides were they get their game from and what type of game they want.





And also i was just trying to give humor with squirt about everyone arguingback and forth on a topic thats beyond our control as individuals, cause in actuality if we cant come together as one uncle sam aint going to care what we want.





thats why i sayLets stop arguing with each other and lets hunt.



Igotcha now. Iguess Iwas misunderstanding your point of view. It seems like ranches are under attack alot lately and Iseem to be really jumpy about it. Anyway, You and all my soldier buddies are in my prayers(as well as the soldiers Idon't know) May God bless you all and keep you safe.







Nate

Jason
02-28-2009, 02:39 AM
It is a huge dream of mine to own a ranch even if its only a few hundred acres. i just want to be able to do what i enjoy doing and get paid for it at same time. and i would feel same about it as you do because i want to be able to manage my game my way and not have to worry bout uncle sam putting his two sense in.





Watch soon they will try to make us have to get the meat fda approved what a freakin joke.

ggonzales
03-26-2010, 07:19 AM
My oponion on this matter is that state and local government should support the ability for land and ranch owners to operate their property to make income from hunting, breeding, or whatever. In these tough hard economic times there should be more done to help those who would like to benefit from their wildlife on their property. I think hunting specfically hog hunting can generate alot of income for Texans who own property, the government should support that in any which way they can, wheter it be buying hogs, trapping hogs, releasing hogs, hunting hogs, whatever it takes to generate income from the hog hunting business.